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Tonights meeting with DEFRA

Discussion in 'Sea Fishing Forum - Shore, Boat & Kayak Fishing' started by Baramundi Bob, Mar 10, 2008.

  1. biscuitlad

    biscuitlad Guest

    Well said. BTW, one way to get rid of the Filey Bay bass nets would be to mention to the twitchers at Bempton the fact that last spring after a storm, I walked along the Brigg and found 10 dead guillemots, half of them still tangled up in the nets... Unlike sea anglers, the twitchers haves always had friends in high places (and I don't mean those in the cabin at the top of Bempton :laugh:)

    Those nets are killing their precious birds in far greater numbers than any damage done by anglers. And anglers along the coast would rejoice to see those nets disappear. A win-win situation? :happy:
     
  2. Baramundi Bob

    Baramundi Bob Super Leeds United !!!

    Just remember that those twitchers wont need much ammo to turn on us either, they have done so already in other areas. People in glass houses really should not throw stones.

    Just like your Hayburn wyke comments you seem to jump in with little knowledge of the consequences of what you seek.
     
  3. wec

    wec Nunc est biben dum

    NESFC have been working with local fisherman and netters to re duce the bird problem,the rspb are well aware of it biscuit lad :wink: many of the dead birds in summer come from the salmon nets.
     
  4. bigcod

    bigcod Rockling


    Phil i must disagree with you on issue of licences and bag limits they would harm chareterboats the thought makes the hairs stand up on my back first a rod licence would do untold damage to sea angling as a hole its in a true word be nothing more than a tax the money defra say they would earn from sea angling licence is pittence compaired to the money lost through VAT for example people dont want licences also why the hell should you pay to fish in the sea anybody who thinks you would get bigger and more fish with a sea angling licence are dreaming there is only one way that will happen and that is if all comercial fishing stopped and beleive me that aint gonna happen bag limits again you dont see the headline in the fishing news anglers crippling cod stocks why because it is an imposibilty rod and line anglers IE fishing for cod take only minute number of what cod is actually taken out of the northsea in real terms more are discared by the commercial fleet than what anglers take if we did have a bag limit it wouldnt make slightest difference to cod stocks we dont even scratch the surface i know that for a fact i do hope the NFSA are against licences and bag limits because the introdution of any these would and i quote would be a disaster for charterbots ,tackle shops and lets not forget your freedom would be gone and that should not happen because of a handfull of people think its the right thing to do i personally have invested heavily with my boat and so have of some of the other skippers we are outraged at the thought of licences and bag limits it would spell the end of chartering in whitby and probably most of the other ports around the uk its bad news just remember phil anglers dont do harm to fish stocks never have done and never will let me give you just one example one of our local trawlers working well north caught over 800 boxes of fish in just 4 hauls the other day filled her up welcome to the real world.

    regards

    paul.
     
  5. smokey

    smokey Rockling

    I know a lad who is on that boat Paul and he's earned £25k in the last 3 months.It says it all for me :sad:
     
  6. biscuitlad

    biscuitlad Guest

    That's it. I'm out of here.

    Why do you ask other people to join in on the forum, if you have to belittle everything they say?
     
  7. Phil A

    Phil A New Member

    Paul,

    I don't want to fall out with you but you've not responded to what I wrote only stated what you think.

    It's obvious really if bags limits were set too low they would effect charter boats, if license fees were set too high they would effect charter boats but as I put in the example an extra £1/day/man and a catch limit of 300lb of cod/man/boat that would be 2400/3000lbs/boat/day. I fail to see how this would effect you.

    In no way did I say I was in favour of these so you can't disagree with me but I did state quite clearly that I don't trust DEFRA to administrate any such initiatives.

    Phil
     
  8. mike_

    mike_ New Member

    must admit it seemed a very harsh reply :sad: and i thought this was one of the friendlier fishing forum's :suspious: - i think the topic conservation triggers it off :yes: :laugh:
    water off a ducks back mate -take no notice - you always get one on a forum :wink:

    all the best mike
     
  9. Ramsrod

    Ramsrod Rockling

    I understand this was only a hypothetical answer Phil but if bag limits were brought in you have to assume that they would effect the present take home bag size or whats the point of altering it?
    I must admit I,m finding it all very confusing. Going back to the meeting, one of the first points that was made was "do you want more and bigger fish" from that point on, from a personal point of view, not only was the answer obvious but also what had to be done to make it happen, which is more restrictions on the commercials. If you can do that my £25 is on it,s way. Someone please tell me if I,m missing something :confused:
     
  10. bigcod

    bigcod Rockling

    Phil i know you mean good but i dont want licences and the majority of anglers dont want licences at any price i think you are missing the point why pay to fish in the sea you wont get nothing for it but restrictions why make our younger anglers pay to fish in the sea its all bollocks i feel very strongly abvout this if we caught 300lb a cod a man as you say i wouldnt be takeing anglers to sea i would be fishing commercially and would be a millonaire in no time you get good and youy get bad days it ballances it self out what is often quoted is when we get good days that is often mentioned by the commercial sector when quoteing what anglers take i know what they take and have taken and i know what we have taken and as i said we dont even scratch the surface bag limits would be a disaster for the northest charterfleet we dont in real terms affect stocks antbody who thinks that we do are wired to the moon.
     
  11. Phil A

    Phil A New Member

    Firstly let me say that part of the reason to give the previous examples was to point out some of the difficulties in deffending the no license and no bag limit stance without knowing more detail.

    Another point to consider is the comparative situation between Britain and America. The situation in this country is that RSA is about on a par with commercial fishing in terms of economical scale. In America there are taxes on fishing tackle and motor boat fuel which pay for fisheries management and other associated costs and as a consequence they have relatively healthy fish stocks. The value of RSA in America when it was last looked at was $20 billion which is 13 times the size of the commercial fishing industry. I'll let you draw your own conclusions.

    One fact that constantly bothers me is that American management has always been superior to British management and British managers are also inferior to managers from the main European countries. This is where my real concern lies.
     
  12. Maxie

    Maxie New Member

    i would love to be wrong but being a bit of a cynic i might as well burn my £25 for all the benefits i beleive a licence would bring.

    why would anyone want to pay for a inferior product that was previously available for nowt :no:
     
  13. smokey

    smokey Rockling

    This is what i can't work out,if 1 million anglers paid the £25 fee,obviously that would raise £25,000,000.Tackle sales in the UK are around £550 million,all of which has VAT paid on it.This means around £90 million is being paid to the UK Government in VAT from tackle each year.When licenses were introduced in Portugal,tackle sales dropped 60% in very quick time.So if the same happened in the UK, that means the government would lose £54 million a year on lost VAT,more than double what the enforcement of a license would bring in.It's no wonder this country is in the sh1t with money,it's bad economics and a no brainer.Like many have said,the promise of "Bigger and More Fish" is a hollow gesture which is never going to happen unless the commercial sector is sorted out first.I know i bang on about the commercials but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out that anglers are being made scapegoats for a bigger problem which won't be tackled until it's too late.Someone quoted about what about the skipper who has just invested £1.5 million into his new boat? I work in the fish trade and have seen what go's on 1st hand,i've seen multiple vehicles swiftly filled to the roof with cod,then mysteriously dissapear into the night,the guys are investing these vast sums of money on state of the art trawlers because they know they are going to make big money as the rules stand now.Anthony Hynes quoted to me personally after the meeting regarding protected areas where the trawlers cannot tow,he said" we are currently trying to get trawler skippers to self police these areas"..what a load of bollocks....tight lines
     
  14. gwyn

    gwyn Blenny

    Consultation questions



    These are the questions that Defra has asked answers for on the RSA Strategy





    Questions

    1) Section 1 Page 4


    What are your overall views on the Strategy?
    Does it miss anything? Which part would you change and how?

    2) Section 1 Page 4


    How often do you go angling?
    Where do you mostly go angling?
    Do you go on angling holidays?
    What sort of angling – shore, own boat or charter vessels?

    3) Section 2 Page 5


    Why do you go sea angling? What are the key reasons for your participation in the sport?
    What is the biggest issue for you affecting your angling?

    4) Section 2 Page 5


    Do you agree with the aim and objectives of the Strategy?
    Which objective do you think is most important?

    5) Section 3 Page 7


    How do you think angling needs can be reflected in fisheries management decisions and policy?
    What do you think is the best way to achieve this?

    6) Section 4 Page 8


    Which species do you value most?
    What action would you like to see taken to improve these stocks?

    7) Section 5 Page 12


    If a sea angling licence were introduced and the revenue spent to provide benefits for sea anglers, would you be willing to pay and how much?

    8) Section 5 Page 12


    Would you support a bag limit for certain species where there is a conservation need and there are controls on commercial exploitation of the same species?

    9) Section 7 Page 15


    What would you spend money on to improve your enjoyment of sea angling?

    10) Section 9 Page 18


    What new sources of information are you aware of that are available to build an evidence base? E.g. data on catches, social studies, angling business turnovers, numbers of people going on charter vessels year on year etc
     
  15. Howard

    Howard Blenny

    This subject has been gone over and over and is sending me dizzy It is a no brainer,tax,self presivation,pensions issue. They must have a very low opinion of us anglers (DEFRA) if they think we will fall for "Do you want more and bigger fish?" B****KS .
    Ray, Do not weaken M8. Do not even think about sending the fee off with the promise of all those cod it will never happen even the toilets are pie in the sea. The £25 today will be £85 soon and the rules and regs. will mean no more free bait gathering and pumps will be well illegel. Those with more than 2 will be slammed up!
     
  16. fishergirl

    fishergirl Blenny

    I cant help but think that the government arent gonna give a sh*t about how many petitions are signed, or how many people email in with their opposing views. all they care about is making more money. only a small percentage of MP's in our country live on the coast, so the majority won't know about how this strategy is going to cause more harm than good. if they were to try and increase fish stocks, then some animal rights group will come along and say that its unfair, inhumane, not right etc.. to breed fish in fish farms out at sea (fish farms that are going to cost a lot of money, hence increasing the cost of the license!) fair enough, it would be great to see more money being put into keeping our beaches, harbours and piers clean and accessible, but how do they expect to do the same for Ravenscar, Bempton, Boulby etc.. i would happily pay £25 or maybe a bit more if they promised to start building some form of ski lift on all the cliffs greater than 75ft! but as that aint gonna happen then they can eff right off and leave us to fish in peace.
     
  17. Baramundi Bob

    Baramundi Bob Super Leeds United !!!

    Ok I think I owe you an apology. I was a little sharp with you the other day. After your Hayburn wyke idea I got a little cheesed off. WRT netters and birds I just get concerned where things come to an end.

    We drop the netters in it becasue some people want rid of them. They in turn complain to the rspb about bait diggers. Tit for tat we strike back. In the end who wins ? The bill oddies and were all left with so many restrictions we cant enjoy our hobbey no more.

    Anyway thats what I should have said the other day. You caught me at a bad time and I apologise :kiss:
     
  18. biscuitlad

    biscuitlad Guest

    No worries mate - these things happen. :wink:
     

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