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[macky]

Me and Graham had a few hours at brid early this morn
Was soon in to mackrel on float fished ragworm and mackrel strip.

we had 8-9 between us  on float but they didnt want to know
the hockeyes.

i also hooked into 2 shad, wether they where Twait shad or allis shad i aint a clue???
but another new species for me for yorkshire
both fish returned

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[Baramundi Bob]

Isn't it funny how mackerel at times will only be caught on the float, its the same up here at Whitby when some nights only float will do and feathers, spinners, daylights etc are all a waste of time. Maybe its a depth thing or maybe its the presentation of the bait. Think Mke fish has recently mastered the float fishing up this end as he usually manages to double everyone elses catches, its amazing what changing tactics ever so slightly can do for your catch rates.

Well done on the Shad by the way  ;) :), we get a few of those up here, usually people think they are Bass (probably cos we get so few bass around and people dont know what they look like).

[Howard]

 Just spent 4hrs working the hockeyes in the very spot this morning Chris hooked into 2 big macks, both dropped off on lifting-not a lot for the time. Just before packing up this bloke came up and said there was 2 blokes catching loads there in that very place on the float yesterday I thought yeah , yeah , yeah . Then  seen youir post and thought bloody ell!!
 Anyway there was a few macky landed but there are millions just out of casting the small boats were slaughtering them.
 Did not realise the float can be so good Bob we will be breadfloating next 8)
Off in the garage to get me old pike floats.

[macky]

Its a killer method mate
but its hard on there as there is so many lines when its packed (as it usually is)
cantr beat seeing a float shoot under the water :P

What was the water clarity like today, as there is a good sea on further south?

[Howard]

  The water was murky down by the wall and I wondered where the hell it had come from as there was the slightest of swell but it "looked" better further out were I was casting. When I left @ slack it had cleared slightly. The next few days it should clear like my G+T with the falling tides as youll know.
 I was suprised at the number of punters still using the cobbles some folk are easily pleased I suppose.
 My mates just spent a fortune on a seajeep and all the electronics and its destined for the compound at southshore--but thats another story. Roll on beach cod  8)

[ferds]

Not had a shad myself but the salmon netter at Sandsend gets a few so they are around further up the coast as well.  He calls them 'rock herring' - no idea if they are twaite or allis

[northbayotter]

Me and Graham had a few hours at brid early this morn
Was soon in to mackrel on float fished ragworm and mackrel strip.

we had 8-9 between us  on float but they didnt want to know
the hockeyes.


i also hooked into 2 shad, wether they where Twait shad or allis shad i aint a clue???
but another new species for me for yorkshire
both fish returned

had a report today that an Allis Shad of abou 2lb was caught from brid peir last night

[Phil A]

Athough Twaite Shad are not at all common Allis Shad are extremely rare and so Chris's fish are almost certainly Twaites. Nigel P. might know if Allis Shad have ever shown up in a local survey.

[macky]

Nige has said to me that if it is caught in the sea it is almost always a allis shad
if caught in a estury or river it is prob a twaite
but with out killing the fish and counting each gill raker it is imposible to know

[Ringer]

http://www.englishnature.org.uk/lifeinukrivers/species/shad.html

[Phil A]

Chris,
I'd base my guess on the relative rarity rather than where caught as both species are caught up rivers and in the sea. If it was over 3lb then I would say it was probably an Allis as a 3lb Twaite would be a very big fish.

[Doc]

Chris, I think you may have misinterpreted my earlier e-mail message.

It doesn't make a difference where the fish are caught, both Twaite and Allis can be caught in the sea and the river.  What I did say is that I have only recorded Allis in the Humber (of course they will have entered the Humber from the sea), whereas I've recorded Twaite in the river and open coast, although the Twaite do prefer the nearshore, which is why they turn up in salmon nets so frequently.  I have only recorded the Allis shad on a couple of occasions in nearly 20 years, although I've seen 100's of Twaite shad over the same time scale.  In addition Allis tend to be planktonivorous, whereas Twaite are Piscivores, feeding on sandeel, sprat and young herring (consequently more likely to take a float fished mackerel bait).

As Chris mentions the only real way to separate the two species is to count the gill rakers on the first gill arch, but then nobody is seriously going to do that.

I would say that I'd be 95% certain that the shad caught are Twaite, based on past experience and the normal distribution of the two species.  Size of fish may assist in a probable identification when species are abundant, however, it is of no use when limited numbers are present.  Phil is right in that Allis grow to a larger size than the Twaite, however, the two Allis I have recorded in this area (Humber) were both immature (24cm & 21cm), as opposed to the Twaite shad which have been measured up to 48cm (c. 1.75lbs).

[Phil A]

Thanks for clearing that up Doc. I was a little surprised by Chris's reference. I think Chris having hooked two fish could fairly safely put them down as twaites. 

[macky]

Sorry doc
i got ur email confused with another, someone else told me a allis shad are usually found in the sea and twaites in the esturys

Anyway
3 of us was ont he wall again yestaday, and we had another 3 shad
again on float fished mackrel

must be loads of um!! ;)